India Bashing

[SAPPORO]

Small cars in US are not same as small cars in India. Indian cars have very less leg space. Any driving over 45mins will start hurting the knees. When driving sedan, SUVs in front will not provide you good visibility of the road. In any case I never understood the popularity of wagon R. It's such odd looking car with small tyres. I always feel it's going to topple any minute. Plus pick up of maruti is just not good enough. There are other better cars to look for than wagon R.

This is just for local driving to get subzi, drink filter coffee/chai. No plan to go out on highway. Bangalore roads are narrow and parking slots are tight compared to NCR. Plus average speed does not go beyond 10-15kmph for most part of the day. I know it is not a safe car, none of the Marutis are. It will be used more like a Honda Activa scooter.

We cannot use sedan anymore - it hurts the knees while getting in/out. SUV type vehicle has easier ingress/egress. I plan to get something like Creta/Brezza later on. Then I realize after retirement with no commute do we need two cars?

"Local driving to get subzi" - should we add it to Lakshya's list of the tell-tale signs of NRIs? Most locals either use two-wheelers or Ola/Uber for the same even of they own cars!

[Returning_Indian]

Delhi/NCR probably has best infra in the country. Among top ten cities in India (number of cars wise), Delhi/NCR has more than rest of the 9 combined. Recently I had the luxury of driving during peak office hours. While traffic flow was smooth it was slow. There were hardly any traffic lights on my drive of around 50km to Delhi. It was all expressway, flyovers, subways, 8-10lane roads. I doubt things can improve much beyond this, infra wise. But the volume of cars on the road is just mind boggling. As soon as there is any exit or entry point, there is a traffic jam. Any merging leads to long backups in highway itself. One car break down leads to atleast 15mins of delay. And this is when trucks are not allowed during peak hours. It looks like the more roads they build, it just increases the number of cars on the street without any improvement in flow of traffic. I saw huge SUVs driven by a single person. Car pooling is an alien concept. I think this should be a lesson for other cities that are developing their infra. Wider/signal free roads is not the solution in India. There has to be something else. Public transportation in its current form is not going to work for upper middle class/car owners. Building metro has only led to getting bikers off the street.

Delhi/NCR also suffers from judgement problem. People judge you based on the car you drive. They give your profile a rating according to your car and then act towards you accordingly. If you drive some cheap car then you will not be treated nicely, no matter how wealthy you may actually be. I have lived in other states in west and they don't suffer from such problem. I think South also doesn't have similar issues. This judgement leads to people spending money on cars to show off. This show off is just to reflect that you are successful professionally.

I also noticed that splendor (read 100cc bike or less) is now more of a cycle. When I was in college it used to be a fun bike and could hang out with friends on splendor. Now it's primarily used by delivery guys. There goes my iconic bike as rest of the young crowd have moved into much bigger/better looking bikes.

[SAPPORO]

Small cars in US are not same as small cars in India. Indian cars have very less leg space. Any driving over 45mins will start hurting the knees. When driving sedan, SUVs in front will not provide you good visibility of the road. In any case I never understood the popularity of wagon R. It's such odd looking car with small tyres. I always feel it's going to topple any minute. Plus pick up of maruti is just not good enough. There are other better cars to look for than wagon R.

This is just for local driving to get subzi, drink filter coffee/chai. No plan to go out on highway. Bangalore roads are narrow and parking slots are tight compared to NCR. Plus average speed does not go beyond 10-15kmph for most part of the day. I know it is not a safe car, none of the Marutis are. It will be used more like a Honda Activa scooter.

We cannot use sedan anymore - it hurts the knees while getting in/out. SUV type vehicle has easier ingress/egress. I plan to get something like Creta/Brezza later on. Then I realize after retirement with no commute do we need two cars?

Good plan to not go out on highway. No cars or SUVs are safe to drive there. Local driving is somewhat a thrill ride, but the highway driving is a 'kill ride' especially if you have a driver. I was on highways for close to 100 hours this time, none of the drivers are professional. They are always on the phone and keep chewing the gutka, never take enough breaks between assignments and drive like maniacs always assuming that nothing fatal would happen. I am planning to take trains for long distance travel on my future trips.

[r2somewhere]

Fretting over taxes is useless. India is a poor country and majority of population is poor. Poor people don't get diabetes, it is a lifestyle disease.

Diabetes is caused by simple carbs - the cheapest form of nutrition. In general, its a poor person's disease. Indians are exceptional because even the rich ones refuse to eat protein and healthy fats.

I understand it's a common theme across social media but there are studies to show that high carb meals do not lead to insulin resistance (precursor to diabetes) anymore than low carb meals, in weight stable patients. I would not focus on protein so much that it can start harming kidneys. Well balanced meals and moderate amount of workout is the way to keep living healthy life and rest is all genetics.

When Indians say 'avoid protein to avoid issues' I have to laugh. Its like women who say - dont go the gym because I dont want to be a bodybuilder.

Even if the average Indian quadrupled their daily intake of protein, they wont be in any danger.

As for diabetes, the numbers are clear. India has same rate of diabetes as US despite per capita income 30x less. Even in the US, its the poor population that is diabetic and fat. Carbs are cheap food.

There are only 3 macro nutrients - protein, carbs and fats. If you are overdoing on 2, you are under eating 1. No one with a straight face can tell me that the average skinny fat Indian is under eating fat or carbs. Which mathematically means they are under eating protein.

[Returning_Indian]

When Indians say 'avoid protein to avoid issues' I have to laugh. Its like women who say - dont go the gym because I dont want to be a bodybuilder.

Even if the average Indian quadrupled their daily intake of protein, they wont be in any danger.

As for diabetes, the numbers are clear. India has same rate of diabetes as US despite per capita income 30x less. Even in the US, its the poor population that is diabetic and fat. Carbs are cheap food.

There are only 3 macro nutrients - protein, carbs and fats. If you are overdoing on 2, you are under eating 1. No one with a straight face can tell me that the average skinny fat Indian is under eating fat or carbs. Which mathematically means they are under eating protein.

it's ok to have assumptions but scientific studies otherwise.

[r2somewhere]

When Indians say 'avoid protein to avoid issues' I have to laugh. Its like women who say - dont go the gym because I dont want to be a bodybuilder.

Even if the average Indian quadrupled their daily intake of protein, they wont be in any danger.

As for diabetes, the numbers are clear. India has same rate of diabetes as US despite per capita income 30x less. Even in the US, its the poor population that is diabetic and fat. Carbs are cheap food.

There are only 3 macro nutrients - protein, carbs and fats. If you are overdoing on 2, you are under eating 1. No one with a straight face can tell me that the average skinny fat Indian is under eating fat or carbs. Which mathematically means they are under eating protein.

it's ok to have assumptions but scientific studies otherwise.

Here is a study on Indians by Indians: https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC6366262/

Here is their recommendation: Get 20-25% of calories from protein. For a 2000 cal diet, that is 400-500 cal of protein. That is 100 grams to 125 grams. Most Indians get less than 30-40 gms a day. For reference, 1 katori daal is 3-4gm of protein. One regular egg is 6gm of protein.

[Returning_Indian]

When Indians say 'avoid protein to avoid issues' I have to laugh. Its like women who say - dont go the gym because I dont want to be a bodybuilder.

Even if the average Indian quadrupled their daily intake of protein, they wont be in any danger.

As for diabetes, the numbers are clear. India has same rate of diabetes as US despite per capita income 30x less. Even in the US, its the poor population that is diabetic and fat. Carbs are cheap food.

There are only 3 macro nutrients - protein, carbs and fats. If you are overdoing on 2, you are under eating 1. No one with a straight face can tell me that the average skinny fat Indian is under eating fat or carbs. Which mathematically means they are under eating protein.

it's ok to have assumptions but scientific studies otherwise.

Here is a study on Indians by Indians: https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC6366262/

Here is their recommendation: Get 20-25% of calories from protein. For a 2000 cal diet, that is 400-500 cal of protein. That is 100 grams to 125 grams. Most Indians get less than 30-40 gms a day. For reference, 1 katori daal is 3-4gm of protein. One regular egg is 6gm of protein.

my point was in regards to cause of diabetes and role carbs play in cause of diabetes. There is no relation that high carb meals (for weight stable people) cause anymore risk of insulin resistance than low carb.

In any case, 25% protein is standard advise for healthy meals. Egg is 80 calories and 6gm of protein is more than 25%. Plus egg yolk provides enzyme to breakdown that protein into usable amino acids. A good source of fat/carbs/protein. Dal's 100 calories has 7-8g protein, another well balanced food. Plus you eat veggies with dal which is good for gut/bacteria. In addition, there is yogurt which again is good source of protein and fat. If you supplement this with salad and some good roti made of millets, ghee then you have a very balanced meal. And all of this doesn't need one to be rich or poor.

Taking protein powder is not essential. It was meant for patients and not general public until social media came along or some wannabe Arnolds started dishing out advise. Recently, lead and cadmium were found while inspecting these powders. Same for egg whites, which without yolk provides very poor form of protein. And these things are being done in excess leading to unnecessary stress on kidneys.

Excessive weight is linked with development of insulin resistance. And refined carbs/sugar do play a significant role in weight gain as they are addictive. Which is what happened when USDA changed its advise in 60s-70s and fats were the villain (primarily to sell corn and related products). Now suddenly carbs are the villain, to sell protein and related products. I don't understand why we have to find villains in food. Why we have to focus on one food group rather than focusing on well balanced meals.

And then there is mass production of chicken, pigs, beef, milk etc laden with antibiotics, hormones which are dangerous for consumption. So this excessive demand has led to dangerous food supply. This whole concept of healthy association with food is missing.

[r2somewhere]

it's ok to have assumptions but scientific studies otherwise.

Here is a study on Indians by Indians: https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC6366262/

Here is their recommendation: Get 20-25% of calories from protein. For a 2000 cal diet, that is 400-500 cal of protein. That is 100 grams to 125 grams. Most Indians get less than 30-40 gms a day. For reference, 1 katori daal is 3-4gm of protein. One regular egg is 6gm of protein.

my point was in regards to cause of diabetes and role carbs play in cause of diabetes. There is no relation that high carb meals (for weight stable people) cause anymore risk of insulin resistance than low carb.

In any case, 25% protein is standard advise for healthy meals. Egg is 80 calories and 6gm of protein is more than 25%. Plus egg yolk provides enzyme to breakdown that protein into usable amino acids. A good source of fat/carbs/protein. Dal's 100 calories has 7-8g protein, another well balanced food. Plus you eat veggies with dal which is good for gut/bacteria. In addition, there is yogurt which again is good source of protein and fat. If you supplement this with salad and some good roti made of millets, ghee then you have a very balanced meal. And all of this doesn't need one to be rich or poor.

Taking protein powder is not essential. It was meant for patients and not general public until social media came along or some wannabe Arnolds started dishing out advise. Recently, lead and cadmium were found while inspecting these powders. Same for egg whites, which without yolk provides very poor form of protein. And these things are being done in excess leading to unnecessary stress on kidneys.

Excessive weight is linked with development of insulin resistance. And refined carbs/sugar do play a significant role in weight gain as they are addictive. Which is what happened when USDA changed its advise in 60s-70s and fats were the villain (primarily to sell corn and related products). Now suddenly carbs are the villain, to sell protein and related products. I don't understand why we have to find villains in food. Why we have to focus on one food group rather than focusing on well balanced meals.

And then there is mass production of chicken, pigs, beef, milk etc laden with antibiotics, hormones which are dangerous for consumption. So this excessive demand has led to dangerous food supply. This whole concept of healthy association with food is missing.

So you dont dispute my numbers. When did I say anything about protein powders? You agree that recommendation is min 100g of protein. How many Indians get that? I struggle to get it myself even with eating multiple eggs and meat daily.

Why do Indians hate protein? Such fear depite most Indians not even getting half the min suggested. But gorging on samosas and gulab jamun is considered 'balanced' diet.

[old-spice2]

So you dont dispute my numbers. When did I say anything about protein powders? You agree that recommendation is min 100g of protein. How many Indians get that? I struggle to get it myself even with eating multiple eggs and meat daily.

Why do Indians hate protein? Such fear depite most Indians not even getting half the min suggested. But gorging on samosas and gulab jamun is considered 'balanced' diet.

I don't think Indians hate proteins. Many of them are vegetarians and do not even eat egg. So only source of protein is from pulses and soyabean which is not part of the regular food habit. Even NV families eat meat 1-2 times a week, it is not like Americans who eat meat in every meal including breakfast. Ahimsa ingrained in the culture/lifestyle has something to do with it?

[r2somewhere]

So you dont dispute my numbers. When did I say anything about protein powders? You agree that recommendation is min 100g of protein. How many Indians get that? I struggle to get it myself even with eating multiple eggs and meat daily.

Why do Indians hate protein? Such fear depite most Indians not even getting half the min suggested. But gorging on samosas and gulab jamun is considered 'balanced' diet.

I don't think Indians hate proteins. Many of them are vegetarians and do not even eat egg. So only source of protein is from pulses and soyabean which is not part of the regular food habit. Even NV families eat meat 1-2 times a week, it is not like Americans who eat meat in every meal including breakfast. Ahimsa ingrained in the culture/lifestyle has something to do with it?

I think Indians do hate protein. I have not seen such fear about any other macro nutrient from Indians. Suggesting whey powder is seen as suggesting poison even though its just milk concentrate. Lead also exists in all the masalas used in foods, but no one seems scared of that. Ahimsa my foot...same shudhh vegetarians have no issues wearing leather shoes and belts.

I think the reason is much simpler. A childish attitude towards food and no control over cravings for carbs and fats. Combine this with absolute disdain for any kind of fitness, you get this protein phobia. Its just justification for pot bellies.