Post retirement life in India

[SAPPORO]

Did not know where to post as I don't want to creat a diary. This is about selling experience of household items.


Few buyers asked why are you going back? Do you have any visa problem? I said I am fleeing from Trump

EDIT - Moved from ""India Bashing"

You can't flee from Trump. All Indian 'news' channels especially India Today were covering pre-inauguration day activities much more than even Fox news would have.

[SAPPORO]

My latest observation from the ground zero. We have all heard about X+1 syndrome for R2I. For retirement in India as it relates to NRIs it is X+5 crores where X is the forecasted NW to retire in India. The inflation is raging in India and to maintain even remotely similar standard of living one needs to add 5 crores to that as of now. Everything costs one-third of what it cost in the US now whereas it costed one-fifth just 3 years ago. If one is working so the income goes up with inflation, they are ok. Fixed-income retirees have a lot of risks even with the appreciating dollar.

[wd40]

My latest observation from the ground zero. We have all heard about X+1 syndrome for R2I. For retirement in India as it relates to NRIs it is X+5 crores where X is the forecasted NW to retire in India. The inflation is raging in India and to maintain even remotely similar standard of living one needs to add 5 crores to that as of now. Everything costs one-third of what it cost in the US now whereas it costed one-fifth just 3 years ago. If one is working so the income goes up with inflation, they are ok. Fixed-income retirees have a lot of risks even with the appreciating dollar.

This is well known in the Indian circles that the services and goods which is consumed by the India 1 alpha population, is getting extremely expensive. For example Goa vacation is more expensive than Thailand vacation. This is because there is a huge surge in demand from the affluent part of the population, but the capacity is still not there.

To know the definition of India 1, 2, 3 etc:

India 1 constitutes approximately 12 crore people with a per capita income of around 10L. India 2 constitutes approximately 10 crore people with a per capita income of around 2.5L. India 3 constitutes approximately 120 crore people with a per capita income of around 1.25L

Even Within India 1, there are two segments, India 1 Alpa with 2.5 crore people with a per capita income of around 30L. India 1 Beta with 9.5 crore people with a per capita income of around 5L.

https://isanthoshgandhi.medium.com/deco ... f0b7294645

The trick to live happily in India is to have income levels of India 1 alpha, but spending patterns of India 1 beta

[wd40]

This is exactly what I mean when I say India becomes extremely expensive for people who belong to the India 1 alpha class:

https://www.facebook.com/share/p/1AyZPoa64m/

Dear @IndiGo6E ,
Obviously this is not just your airlines, but since you are the airline I have primarily used when I fly within India, I wanted to share with you my disappointment (and certainly the disappointment of many Hindus like me), given your latest flight fares.
It costs $958 to fly from Dallas (USA) to Bengaluru (India), in economy, roundtrip.
It costs $747 roundtrip to fly from Bengaluru to Prayagraj, for #MahaKumbh2025 .
It may or maybe not be about an issue of affordability for me, but I certainly know for a middle class Hindu family in India (Bengaluru in this case), flying to participate in Mahakumbh could be unaffordable, and remain a distant dream.
In a Hindu majority country, it may not be a bad idea to keep the fares nominal, and enable more Hindus to participate in Mahakumbh.

Now if you are the type of person who wants to fly from Bangalore to Prayagraj for a Mahakumbh and expect to pay cheap fares, then forget it. It is not happening in India. India becomes even more expensive than Switzerland.

But I know I can live happily in India, living like a middle class India 1 Beta person, booking flights only when they are cheap or using the train. What is the hurry when you are retired? I see hippies who come to India and travel in the Indian railways for months together backpacking. It is much more enjoyable way of travelling.

As an investor in Indian markets, I am happy that these India 1 alpha people are consuming and splurging, because all that inflation in turn translates to profits for the companies and stock prices rise to make up more than the inflation.

[SAPPORO]

My latest observation from the ground zero. We have all heard about X+1 syndrome for R2I. For retirement in India as it relates to NRIs it is X+5 crores where X is the forecasted NW to retire in India. The inflation is raging in India and to maintain even remotely similar standard of living one needs to add 5 crores to that as of now. Everything costs one-third of what it cost in the US now whereas it costed one-fifth just 3 years ago. If one is working so the income goes up with inflation, they are ok. Fixed-income retirees have a lot of risks even with the appreciating dollar.

This is well known in the Indian circles that the services and goods which is consumed by the India 1 alpha population, is getting extremely expensive. For example Goa vacation is more expensive than Thailand vacation. This is because there is a huge surge in demand from the affluent part of the population, but the capacity is still not there.

To know the definition of India 1, 2, 3 etc:

India 1 constitutes approximately 12 crore people with a per capita income of around 10L. India 2 constitutes approximately 10 crore people with a per capita income of around 2.5L. India 3 constitutes approximately 120 crore people with a per capita income of around 1.25L

Even Within India 1, there are two segments, India 1 Alpa with 2.5 crore people with a per capita income of around 30L. India 1 Beta with 9.5 crore people with a per capita income of around 5L.

https://isanthoshgandhi.medium.com/deco ... f0b7294645

The trick to live happily in India is to have income levels of India 1 alpha, but spending patterns of India 1 beta

Not sure about the Alphas and Betas but for my lifestyle, US is much cheaper than India. I could get a Taco Bell build your own cravings box for $5.99 or a Chipotle bowl for $10 and my wife and I can share it in a decent air-conditioned restaurant without the fear of dogs and cats roaming around us and the fear of any food poisoning. In fact, there is a little eatery that opened around the corner with decent prices like 100 INR for a Masala Dosa but my DW refused to go there since the eating area is pretty much open for stray dogs! I can fly for $50 - $100 roundtrip as well to most of the places I need to in the US whereas I had to pay $200 RT for my recent trip to Rajasthan and I booked 3 months in advance and there was no free meal as it used to be in the past. Don't even get me started about the disproportionate real estate prices!

[wd40]

My latest observation from the ground zero. We have all heard about X+1 syndrome for R2I. For retirement in India as it relates to NRIs it is X+5 crores where X is the forecasted NW to retire in India. The inflation is raging in India and to maintain even remotely similar standard of living one needs to add 5 crores to that as of now. Everything costs one-third of what it cost in the US now whereas it costed one-fifth just 3 years ago. If one is working so the income goes up with inflation, they are ok. Fixed-income retirees have a lot of risks even with the appreciating dollar.

This is well known in the Indian circles that the services and goods which is consumed by the India 1 alpha population, is getting extremely expensive. For example Goa vacation is more expensive than Thailand vacation. This is because there is a huge surge in demand from the affluent part of the population, but the capacity is still not there.

To know the definition of India 1, 2, 3 etc:

India 1 constitutes approximately 12 crore people with a per capita income of around 10L. India 2 constitutes approximately 10 crore people with a per capita income of around 2.5L. India 3 constitutes approximately 120 crore people with a per capita income of around 1.25L

Even Within India 1, there are two segments, India 1 Alpa with 2.5 crore people with a per capita income of around 30L. India 1 Beta with 9.5 crore people with a per capita income of around 5L.

https://isanthoshgandhi.medium.com/deco ... f0b7294645

The trick to live happily in India is to have income levels of India 1 alpha, but spending patterns of India 1 beta

Not sure about the Alphas and Betas but for my lifestyle, US is much cheaper than India. I could get a Taco Bell build your own cravings box for $5.99 or a Chipotle bowl for $10 and my wife and I can share it in a decent air-conditioned restaurant without the fear of dogs and cats roaming around us and the fear of any food poisoning. In fact, there is a little eatery that opened around the corner with decent prices like 100 INR for a Masala Dosa but my DW refused to go there since the eating area is pretty much open for stray dogs! I can fly for $50 - $100 roundtrip as well to most of the places I need to in the US whereas I had to pay $200 RT for my recent trip to Rajasthan and I booked 3 months in advance and there was no free meal as it used to be in the past. Don't even get me started about the disproportionate real estate prices!

The equivalent of Taco bell is 1 plate of idly vada(2 idlis and 1 vada), you can get for 65 Rupees in a nice Udupi upahara, accross the street in my neighbourhood in bangalore

https://www.zomato.com/bangalore/udupi- ... -bangalore



The rent for the 2 bedroom house which my dad has currently rented out is 16k rupees.

So like I said, it depends on which class you belong

Also, as they say, when in Rome do as the Romans do. When in the US, live like you live in the US and you will be happy and when in India, live like how Indians do and you will be happy.

The main point is whether you like to live in India or you like to live in the US. This discussion about India being expensive is a moot point, because the people who want to come back and live in India, will figure out how to live like how other Indians do. The fact that NRIs have earned in dollars and made use of the geo arbitrage, so already a huge advantage compared to resident Indians, who will take 2 or 3 lives to accumulate the same amount. If these NRIs still cannot make it work in India, then clearly they were never meant to return to India. They have upgraded their lifestyle to developed world standards, so there is no geo arbitrage left to extract, you earned in the US, you spend in the US.

[SAPPORO]

Continued COL - All comparisons between Tampa and Bangalore. In fact, I had a "Balti-mug-Bath" moment this morning. I see a lot of new immigrants in Tampa as opposed to in NJ and I always wondered how come they spend like drunken sailors. It occurred to me that it's because the things are cheaper starting from 3500 SFT independent house for 450-500K.
Udupi hotel compares to hot dogs for a dollar or two from a food truck. To replicate Taco Bell or Chipotle in a climate-controlled restaurant should cost the same if not more in Bangalore. Sit-in meal at my favorite Thai restaurant for two costs $40-$50 in Tampa and should be around 2k-3k In Bangalore. Chinese takeout of Kung-pao Chicken and Fried rice - $15-$20 and should be easily around 1-1.5K in Bangalore. Electricity bill for 4000 SFT house with centralized climate-control and all cooking $100-$115 for me in Tampa as opposed to don't know how much in Bangalore.

As I have always insisted, the biggest (only?) bang for the buck one gets for retiring in India is IF one rents a place instead of buying since RE prices have been inflated by NRIs/speculators that may never live there and have a lot of vacant units.

[SAPPORO]

I am pretty sure the discussion will end up with doctors, dentist and retirement homes. I am currently going thru some dental procedures in Bangalore and would update soon about my experiences.

[wd40]

Continued COL - All comparisons between Tampa and Bangalore. In fact, I had a "Balti-mug-Bath" moment this morning. I see a lot of new immigrants in Tampa as opposed to in NJ and I always wondered how come they spend like drunken sailors. It occurred to me that it's because the things are cheaper starting from 3500 SFT independent house for 450-500K.
Udupi hotel compares to hot dogs for a dollar or two from a food truck. To replicate Taco Bell or Chipotle in a climate-controlled restaurant should cost the same if not more in Bangalore. Sit-in meal at my favorite Thai restaurant for two costs $40-$50 in Tampa and should be around 2k-3k In Bangalore. Chinese takeout of Kung-pao Chicken and Fried rice - $15-$20 and should be easily around 1-1.5K in Bangalore. Electricity bill for 4000 SFT house with centralized climate-control and all cooking $100-$115 for me in Tampa as opposed to don't know how much in Bangalore.

As I have always insisted, the biggest (only?) bang for the buck one gets for retiring in India is IF one rents a place instead of buying since RE prices have been inflated by NRIs/speculators that may never live there and have a lot of vacant units.

I respectfully, disagree that Udupi restaurants compare with hot dogs. These are nice sit in Udupi restaurants. The equivalent of hot dogs is probably vada pav theli in Bombay. I can eat in Udupi restaurants everyday, it is our staple morning diet. I am not sure if hot dogs can be eaten every day for breakfast.

For a nice sit in restaurant for lunch/dinner, I would say Bhagini is a nice andhra restaurant in Bangalore, Chicken Biryani costs 200 Rs, I think Rs 800 is kind of lavish for 2 people.

https://www.zomato.com/bangalore/bhagin ... field/menu



Real estate is expensive, I agree, but it is part investment part expense. It will always be expensive, so if you want to retire in India and eventually want to transfer an asset to your kids, get on the bandwagon now, otherwise your kids will again be saying the same thing that Indian RE is expensive. I am glad my dad bought a house in Bangalore, so I have that hedge.

[wd40]

Here are Numbeo's figures of Tampa v/s Bangalore: https://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living/c ... ampa%2C+FL

Local Purchasing Power in Tampa, FL is 18.8% higher than in Bangalore, so it is not such a big difference really.

Now compare Bangalore with Birmingham, https://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living/c ... Birmingham

Local Purchasing Power in Birmingham is 2.3% lower than in Bangalore, this is what I expect for most places in the world when compared with Bangalore.